Monday, September 22, 2008


Do a google search for MVC MVP and you will find no shortage of posts on the topic.

If you want pictures and diagrams and code samples I'll let you do the Google search. But, in brief, MVC stands for Model View Controller, MVP stands for Model View Presenter. What's the difference?

There is no difference! Well, if you look at it in enough detail, you'll be able to come up with all kinds of stuff, but if you look at the overall picture, there's really no practical difference.

Ok, I knew you wouldn't be happy with that answer... In MVC the View is stateless. When you interact with it (by clicking a button, for example) that action is forwarded directly to the "Controller" which then renders a new View.

In MVP, the View may or may not have state. In either case, when you interact with it the View handles that action (aka, the View has hooked into an event) and forwards the action into a call to the "Presenter." Unlike in MVC where a new View is rendered, in MVP the Presenter has to cause the View to update somehow. This can be done with data binding, or by the method on the Presenter returning data that the View parses, or by the Presenter raising an event that the View receives, or even by the Presenter calling a method on the View...

There is one other element. In MVC, there is a Controller for every View. In MVP, you don't strictly have to have one Presenter for every View. You could have many Presenters per View. You could have a Presenter for every "Control" in your View. Or you could have a Presenter for logical regions of your View.

In the end, the View is the same in both cases: it displays stuff. The Model is the same in both cases: it represents the data. And the Controller/Presenter is the same: it does stuff that the user asked for.

MVC is very applicable to the web, where actions on the rendered html page "post back" to the Controller on the web server.

MVP is very applicable to Windows Forms and WPF where actions on the Form/Window raise events which delegate the majority of the work to the Presenter.

Clearly, these patterns are pretty simple. But they get a lot of attention, and there is a lot of confusion surrounding them. Partly this is because Computer Scientists all have a bit of the Martin Fowler syndrome in them, so we feel like we need to classify everything. We like to have everything all lined up and tagged and placed in the right pigeon hole. Sometimes this is a good thing, other times it can lead to a "can't see the forest for the trees" type of problem.

But mainly, I think these patterns confuse people because they're named horribly. In MVC, the Controller doesn't control the View. The word "controller" invokes an image of a puppet master pulling the strings. The Controller is much more hands off than that. It's really more like an Interpreter or a Router which says, "Ah, I see you clicked the Send button. Allow me to route that to the proper sending authorities, and then I'll send you a new view." So while it certainly does control the application and how the view responds to action, "Controller" is just too loaded of a word.

In MVP, I really can't understand where the word "Presenter" came from. Maybe it's supposed to make you think of a presentation where the Powerpoint slides are the View, and the person talking and moving the slides ahead is the Presenter. But in reality it sounds more like there are two views... I think of the Presenter more like a Calculator. You're working out some equation on paper (the View) and using a calculator to execute certain functions for you, the results of which you record on the paper.

In the end the titles get in the way. What we want is a way to separate as much of our logic as we can from the display. This allows us to do a few things:
  1. Test our logic with TDD
  2. Change the display without requiring huge changes to our logic
  3. Change our logic without requiring huge changes to our display
At least, this is how I'm looking at it right now. I reserve the right to learn something new tomorrow and start from scratch.


  1. I think there actually is a significant difference between MVC and MVP.

    In MVP, the View never interacts with the Model. It's more like a 3-tier system.

    In MVC, the data flows between the Model to the View (this can be initiated by either the View or the Model).

  2. It depends on what kind of MVC you're talking about. There are many flavors. Two that Martin Fowler talks about are Active vs Passive.

    The primary difference is in how the view gets its data.


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